Are we all Neopagans ? ...

Comment

Comment by Founder on November 16, 2008 at 1:37pm

Jack,

The spectrum of our examination covers many centuries, so that my answer can vary through which era I'm addressing. However I believed that Paganism reached its maximum potentiality with the Greco-Roman Philosophers that reached an amazing equilibrium among philosophy(logic)-magic-science-mathematic etc...
Those Pagan philosophers believed also ( most of them at least ) in a first principle that can be seen as God, so that this leads to the conclusion that the polytheistic approach was just describing the Divine in action, rather than the Divine as the One, creator principle. Then we have to rethink about Paganism being just a series of polytheistic religions or cults....!!
As an example, the Christian doctrines, whether basic, powerful or essential were seen from a Pagan perspective, compared to the precedent Greco-Roman knowledge, as a puerile attempt to create a new religion for ignorant people!
All that initiated the antagonism among the two parties. But Paganism never tried to shut up logic or a logical process of the mind. Instead the monotheist religions ( Christianism, Judaism, Islam ... ) based the whole doctrinal corpum on a fideistic approach and they suppressed with violence any attempt of human intelligence to show up in the name of a prophet or God ...
So that the problem of the various persecutions one by another and vice versa is secondary to the one which is related to the attempt to shut up the logical process of the mind!

Finally, my religion deifies logic because it embraces philosophy and science in a logically, materialistically & spiritually unified path ...

for more you can check my website www.neopagan.com

Comment by Founder on November 15, 2008 at 3:38am

JackFlash,

Besides the wide angle perspective you can look at my "vision", primarily my focus is on:
Historical evidences, which demonstrate how main religions as Judaism, Christianism, Islam, among others, are born and shaped on previous Pagan models ... This implies that Paganism, meaning by that all the various old cults that formed it, needs to be not only recognized and legitimated by these new contemporary religions, but also they need to see and acknowledge themselves as the new "revised" contemporary Pagans!! ( another issue is, if we like it or not, the perspective taken of the original old Pagan models by those new religions...).
In this picture we can consider ourselves, meaning the Neopagans, as the leading edge among the whole worldwide Pagan community!!

Regarding religions, since they are coming historically from common sources, even with different small original peculiarities, we can say whether we like it or not that they are definitely bubbling in the "same pot".

Finally, in your post you say "Logic is always an insult to religion and religion always defies logic...", I feel this "extreme" way of thinking is a main reason why through the ages Paganism was adversed and persecuted ( do I have to recall how many people were burn at stake by the Roman church ? ...).
In other words the so called Religious Authorities banned and killed anybody that would have showed or conjugated philosophy-thought ( logic ) with religion !!
Lets put down straight: Our "enlightened" today rulers, Popes, Ayatollah, Mullah & co., just want you to follow a fidesitic or revealed doctrine, putting an end to using your mind... WRONG and DANGEROUS !!!!
This has nothing to do with the fact that, during the Pagan or philosophical practices at a certain point you need to overcome your mind to merge with the superior energies, what was called the "flight of the soul" or the vertical path...

It is then absolutely to be considered WRONG, in my opinion, to detach logic-philosophy from the cultual, doctrinal part of a religion or a cult.

I will say then that we don't really need is a faith based, blind religion, but a true and sincere one that can embed a logical approach to the Universe ...
My ideal "religion" deifies logic instead of defying it.
Only ignorance defies logic ...

Comment by Rowan Canterbury on November 14, 2008 at 2:03pm

I have to agree. I have been teaching pagan faith for some time now and being taught a bit differently from the main stream pagans I have noticed that they are VERY structured and really depend on a Hiarchy with different levels of office. To me that is not Pagan...that is Christian and or Religious. I tend to shy away from covens that have high priests or priestesses. I also tend to stay away from Witch Schools...not that I don't think it is great that our way of life is getting out there...but I have always been taught that we are not for sale and neither are our gifts...Materialism however is a SICKNESS that permeates literally every part of our society. Sadly enough much of the practice and long ingraining of greed came from the Church. I don't know where you can look where someone isn't trying to turn a buck. However we as pagans Neo or no..have choices. If you study long enough hopefully it becomes clear to you that it is not all about power and money...and we are free..and we are strong enough in our belief of the divine to stand the onslaught of oppression in any form...
By the way..I am so enjoying your company and your blogs..it is refreshing.

Comment by Founder on November 13, 2008 at 8:51am

Rowan,

As you mentioned, the need to exterminate Pagans is coming mainly from the Major Religious reformers and rulers. They control the scene trying to stop the truth and denying undeniable evidences. So that they stay on top through the ages, retaining power and making a huge profit out of it !

But the time we are approaching will take care of this illegitimate and blind guides ...

Comment by Rowan Canterbury on November 13, 2008 at 7:43am

I was fortunate enough to have been pagan all my life and raised with pagan beliefs. Much of my family is first or second generation in this country. It is neat to learn how many of these traditions have survived the test of time. (even if many Christians have no idea that they practice a great number of them) I like to think of Pagans as the (excuse the expression) cockroaches of the religious world. No matter how much they try to exterminate us, we keep coming back. Unlike the Jews, who could also be dubbed thus...we have been unable to express our beliefs for fear of persecution from almost everyone. So historically speaking I know I am the daughter of a long line of Scottish pagans...I feel that all that choose this wide and virtually multi faceted spiritual path are indeed Neo-pagan..or the Renaissances of the old beliefs if you will.
Is that more like it??
Blessings
Rowan

Comment by Founder on November 13, 2008 at 6:43am

The primary meaning of my blog topic "Are we all Neopagans?" was to underline the legacy ( surely from a historical point of view ) from the various ancient cults. So that the way we perceive our "Pagan status" is a secondary issue in this blog discussion ...
Now that means, according to my thoughts: ALL of us, in my opinion, whether Pagans or Non Pagans ( better then to say the Whole Human Race ) are Neopagans!!!!
That means on this planet Earth there are different cults or religions differently approaching the Divine, but the people are all Pagans or Neopagans ( the new Pagans!!!! ).
Furthermore, one of my goals as the neopagan.com and Neopagan World community founder, is to better focus the whole Pagan picture from historical facts to cultual practices through spiritual beliefs.
Believe it or not, as I know that many of you know a lot about our roots, a lot of people are still in the limbo about it.
It is then for me of major importance to re-establish a "correct" point of view about what we are and why ...
This is a big and touchy issue for many of us who are rejecting or avoiding the roots and their historical implications. As an example, it won't be easier for a Christian to consider himself a derivative from pre-existant Roman Mithraism .... and so on ...
Especially if we need to realize that we are ALL Pagans in essence. No matter what we think or we perceive ourselves, we are following old paths that are our roots. Understanding this makes the whole picture legitimated and consequentially for us it will be much easier to live freely and legitimately in our Pagan status, magically enhancing our connection with the superior forces-energies.
So that being Pagan today, or Neopagan, is not to be seen anymore as "mark of a beast" or to be eccentric !!
Furthermore, it is really important for the confused neopagans and the rest of the world, to reestablish their historical roots in order to clarify their views and thoughts that are deviated, among other issues, mainly by incorrect use of history and manipulative and insincere religious propaganda !!
No matter how other fellow Pagans will think, whether it can be seen as relevant or not, I will devote part of my energies to this task: make clear where our roots are and why we are ALL Neopagans in essence and in real life !!!

Comment by erthgoddss on November 12, 2008 at 3:06pm

I have never really thought about it until now. I am pagan. I consider myself part of an old belief system that never died, but was practiced in secret. I have been called many names... some were not very polite... so if someone wants to label me new or neopagan.. so be it. I don't think it really matters.

Comment by Grimalkin del Freya on November 12, 2008 at 11:18am

"Does it really matter, and why?" is my first response.

After all, isn't the ultimate goal in any and all religions that the individual achieve unity with the Infinite Spirit, The Goddess/God, The Ultimate Universal Power? Aren't we all seeking that reunification with that energy force no matter what we each may envision or what name we may call it? Maybe I am over simplifying or completely missing the point but we are all traveling our individual Paths towards that goal and to me it seems that the end does justify the means. Though I realize some people take comfort in such things, for me when it comes to such a unique and personal choice as each person's beliefs and spirituality, no labels are really needed ...or especially wanted!

Comment by Rowan Canterbury on November 12, 2008 at 6:40am

As will all life we can only evolve. Our lives are much different from our pagan forefathers. We are creatures of emotion more than creatures of the physical and earth bound as they were. Because the pagan faiths were vastly oral it is difficult now, on this side of Christianity, to find a foundation. As with all religion things can be compared and argued. We are all only guessing. Neopagan is a name or title...just as Jew, Christian, you name it. The true difference (to me anyway) is in our actions and the way we choose to live our lives. I never get hung up on labels and stay away from people that cling to Structured values with a Religious flavor. I believe to be pagan in essence is to be free mentally and physically to explore the unknown and learn about the divine.

Laugh with the Maiden, Love with the Mother and Learn from the Crone...

Rowan

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